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Camshafts and Ignition timing remap

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  • Camshafts and Ignition timing remap

    Can anyone tell me;

    in the past I put SVT camshafts in an SE and swapped the PCM too.

    Now I want to put SVT cam's in an SE without swapping the PCM

    Is there an ignition timing table difference or are there no timing adjustments required to run properly

    thanks
    ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

    WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

  • #2
    Wouldn't the timing be the same? The cam shaft sensor determines the timing.
    98 Silver Frost
    Full 3.0L
    ST220 intake

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    • #3
      Hey Squeek; this is exactly what I'm trying to find out.

      I believe the cam sensor tells the PCM where the cam is in its rotation .... but what I don't know, is if the ignition timing base map is modified between the SE and the SVT to allow for the camshaft difference.

      I'm pretty sure the car will run fine after the cam swap .... i'm trying to find out if i'm leaving some power on the table by not adjusting the timing map etc.

      I don't have access to the SE and SVT PCM maps ... i'm hoping someone that does, will be able to say one way or the other, at least then I know which way I need to go ....G.
      ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

      WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

      Comment


      • #4
        With noticeable difference between the 3l cam and 2.5 cam while running the svt eco. I bet there will be more power to be captured.
        98 Silver Frost
        Full 3.0L
        ST220 intake

        Comment


        • #5
          ... that's a perfect example;

          from what I remember, the 3l cam's give more low end torque.

          To my mind, the SVT was tuned for top end power, so a retune would be optimal.

          The question is, what is remapped to best suit the 3l cam's ....or the SVT cam's for that matter ... the timing map ?.... G.
          ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

          WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

          Comment


          • #6
            The CRANK sensor is used for timing but ignition timing would be close on both cam sets. I would be far more concerned with the open loop fuel maps as those should be quite a bit different. Bigger cams will change the upper rpm fuel demand and tend to lean out at open loop full throttle since the lesser cam software will not cover that demand.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by amc49 View Post
              The CRANK sensor is used for timing but ignition timing would be close on both cam sets. I would be far more concerned with the open loop fuel maps as those should be quite a bit different. Bigger cams will change the upper rpm fuel demand and tend to lean out at open loop full throttle since the lesser cam software will not cover that demand.
              thanks for that reply;

              Hmmm... new fuel pump I think. I have no experience of non return, so this will be interesting.... G.

              ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

              WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

              Comment


              • #8
                Can anyone clarify if the early non return SVTs were 2544cc and not 2497cc, thanks ...G.
                ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

                WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

                Comment


                • #9
                  Return and non return pumps are basically the same, the difference being the nonR has a pump driver module that speeds up and slows down the pump, meaning the nonR pump may be a bit more durable as it has to run slower at times which can load the motor more (lugging electric motors is harder on them).

                  Also, the non returns are not as returnless as one might think, there can be a check ball or two right there in the later plastic module that either keeps the module case full of fuel or pre-establishes fuel pressure to a great extent just down from the pump outlet. In short, there can be a bypass right at the module itself.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by amc49 View Post
                    Return and non return pumps are basically the same, the difference being the nonR has a pump driver module that speeds up and slows down the pump, meaning the nonR pump may be a bit more durable as it has to run slower at times which can load the motor more (lugging electric motors is harder on them)..
                    Thanks for that

                    This is interesting; I've been looking for an uprated ford pump ... just to keep things simple. I've discovered the fuel pump in ford's later non return cars seem to crap out regularly.

                    Ford also seem to have 'updated' the non return pumps regularly ... looking for a late one I guess....G.
                    ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

                    WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      ignition map are going to be completely different. that is different then the timing chain timing
                      1999 Mercury Cougar Full 3.0L MTX
                      236HP

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                      • #12
                        ..... I'm alright on the mechanical side of things.... I have a 36 and 42 tooth set of SVT cam's.

                        Hoping dreamscience can 'update' my MAPs to suit..... G.
                        ST24. LPG, 2001 ST200 motor, 65mm P&P'd TB, 80mm MAF, headers, lowered, sway bars and strut braces, 300/278mm brakes, 3.51 FD 3.0L tranny, Torsen, Fidanza.... Vortech nearly completed.

                        WANTED; Custom gauge guru for ST200 overlay job... pm me..

                        Comment

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