PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
I know that the duratec is capable of all of that and more. The end.
striker2 said:
Sources? The zetec is an iron block while the duratec is aluminum, so the weights are actually very close, within 100 pounds.
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A video that I found
- Thread starter PacificTourG
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I know that the duratec is capable of all of that and more. The end.
Sources? The zetec is an iron block while the duratec is aluminum, so the weights are actually very close, within 100 pounds.
pre98zetec
Veteran CEG'er
You'd be surprised..
striker2
Official CEG Vendor
Sources? The zetec is an iron block while the duratec is aluminum, so the weights are actually very close, within 100 pounds.[/quote]
i know for a fact that the average zetec MTX weighs in at about 2700 lbs and the average SVT is around 3000+ lbs
plus the iron block is stronger than an aluminum block. im not saying the v6 block cant make lots of power (we've seen it done). im simply saying that zetec with the proper internals would be capable of more power per liter than the duratec.
theres also more room in the engine bay for FI mods with the zetec :laugh: :laugh:
purplemystique:
you cant compare it to the probe. it started out with less power and had horible gear ratios. and to think Ford almost called it the mustang.
Tedbalog:
i do believe there is at least 2 maybe threee of us that have plans hiding from CEG. why? cause CEG bashes the zetec. this thread proves it. this whole site is all about the duratec.
most of the people chose to spend more money initally to buy an SVT and have about 170 hp (at the wheels) i could get the same power to weight ratio out of the zetec and only spend abut $1k on mods and when you can buy one for about $1-2K youve spent less money and have the same power/weight ratio. for a few hundred more you can have better than SVT handling (still spent less than the intial investment of the SVT) ok so now you want FI. both models you have to make your own turbo kit. its definatly cheaper to make a kit for a 4 cylinder than a v6. you want a S/C instead. they sell kits for the focus that virtually bolt on to the zetec. last time i checked they dont sell a kit (anymore) for the duratec.
I personally love my little zetec. do i want an SVT? only for body parts. even then i dont know that i would put on the kit. looks cool sure but looks dont make it go faster.
i know for a fact that the average zetec MTX weighs in at about 2700 lbs and the average SVT is around 3000+ lbs
plus the iron block is stronger than an aluminum block. im not saying the v6 block cant make lots of power (we've seen it done). im simply saying that zetec with the proper internals would be capable of more power per liter than the duratec.
theres also more room in the engine bay for FI mods with the zetec :laugh: :laugh:
purplemystique:
you cant compare it to the probe. it started out with less power and had horible gear ratios. and to think Ford almost called it the mustang.
Tedbalog:
i do believe there is at least 2 maybe threee of us that have plans hiding from CEG. why? cause CEG bashes the zetec. this thread proves it. this whole site is all about the duratec.
most of the people chose to spend more money initally to buy an SVT and have about 170 hp (at the wheels) i could get the same power to weight ratio out of the zetec and only spend abut $1k on mods and when you can buy one for about $1-2K youve spent less money and have the same power/weight ratio. for a few hundred more you can have better than SVT handling (still spent less than the intial investment of the SVT) ok so now you want FI. both models you have to make your own turbo kit. its definatly cheaper to make a kit for a 4 cylinder than a v6. you want a S/C instead. they sell kits for the focus that virtually bolt on to the zetec. last time i checked they dont sell a kit (anymore) for the duratec.
I personally love my little zetec. do i want an SVT? only for body parts. even then i dont know that i would put on the kit. looks cool sure but looks dont make it go faster.
Nezerconezer
Hard-core CEG'er
Our SVTs have all the options availible wich add quite a few pounds to the car. How much wieght would be saved if SVTs had no Sun Shine roof or smaller breaks a standard radiator no body kit. That 300 weigh difference is not the duratecs fault.
tedBalog
CEG'er
Jinx....I think you just screwed yourself. Touch wood, fast
Done.
I just plan to drive this car till it dies. Hopefully it doesn't get expensive to upkeep. If I had the money, I'd probobly sell and buy an SVT, just because I don't have all the goodies that the SVT has, and I don't care for the pre-98 look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tedBalog
When it keeps up with a cavalier
lol
My point wasn't that it kept up, but that he paid a whole hell of a lot more then I did for a car that isn't worth it.
PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
My main point was not for SVTs, but for Duratecs. A similarly-equipped Duratec Contique will cost and weigh marginally more than a Zetec counterpart. What-his-name wasted countless hours and dollars supercharging his Zetec and he ended up with, what, 170hp? That's about a 15 flat in the quarter...nothing special by any means. Time and money well spent? Of course not.
Um...the probe started out with TWO fewer horsepower. That difference is absolutely nothing when things like engine wear, temperature, altitude, etc are all factored in. Plus the Probe weighs less, and I can assure you quarter mile times for the 4cyl MTXs are VERY similar.
Ever think that there might be a good reason for that?
[/QUOTE]
Yes, and a $500 80s Camaro will beat a brand new Toyota Echo that costs 24 times more, but that doesn't make it a better car.
pre98zetec
Veteran CEG'er
actually if you wanna get technical its 7hp less
PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
Oh yeah, I forgot the Zetec was 125, I was thinking 120 for some reason. Either way the lbs to hp ratio is within a few tenths.
striker2
Official CEG Vendor
i believe you are talking about Hector who is a highly regareded CEGer. he still drives a 4 banger.:laugh: its a very fast 4 banger at that.purplemystique said:
my point is that just because its a 4-cylinder does not mean that the engine does not have potential.
Lets do some math.
the standard duratec comes with 170 hp. 85% of that (drivetrain loss) is 144.5 hp at the wheels im gonna assume the average ceger as atleast done intake and exhaust so ill say 150hp for the duratec at about 6200rpms and has a displacement of 152.5 Cubic Inches.
VE=(5600*hp)/(rpm*CID)
VE=(5600*150)/(6200*152.2)
VE=.89
the engine is about 89% efficient meaning its only using 2.225L of its displacement.
now for my car which has intake, exhaust, and 230K miles. ive put it on the dyno and have these numbers to back it up.
121 Hp@~5800rpm at the wheels so i dont have to calculate drivetrain loss.
122 CID
VE=(5600*121)/(5800*122)
VE=.957
so my car has a VE of about 96%. it uses about 1.92L of whats available. thats only a .305L differeance. the stock zetec breathes better from the factory than the duratec. the potential is there. most of this site doesnt see it however and bash the zetec like its just a little $#!^box engine that cant make any power no matter what (proven by your statement about hector only making 170hp)
this brings me back to my point that you can spend a total of about $3-4k and have a nice little zetec that will outperform the standard duratec that you could have bought for the same 3-4K that includes upgrading the suspension to out manuver it also. for another 2-3k you can be pushing similar power numbers as a stock SVT and still out manuver it. so your looking at about 6-7K for either a nice stock SVT or a modified zetec that outperforms it in every aspect. and if you can find good deals on body parts, looks just as good. the reason most people dont do it is cause they dont have the knowledge to do so. instead they spend the 6k on a stock SVT or mildly modified SE.
as for why hector didnt make anymore HP, i assume he didnt want to risk blowing it up as it was his only ride and daily driver. you also realize that it wa 170HP at the wheels through an ATX which means he was making anywhere from about 210-230 HP at the crankshaft. he could have very easily made more power if he wanted to. he still wishes he hadnt sold it.
BK4293
Hard-core CEG'er
I drove it I call B.S.!!!!!!
I owned a Zetec I call B.S.
I owned a Duratec...She's gone too!!!!
Damn, No more Contours for Steve
striker2
Official CEG Vendor
Steve you dont count. two contours and three engines later you still dont have a decent one :laugh: :crazy:
you gave up and went with a Grand Prix
and by all means i know it not super fast but it is faster than people give it credit
you gave up and went with a Grand Prix
and by all means i know it not super fast but it is faster than people give it credit
ButtonPuncher
Veteran CEG'er
Insane for modding a Zetec? LOL!
I'm going to be the happiest nutjob around when I'm stoping SVTs with my supercharged Zetec.
...stomping N/A 3L, and FI'd 2.5s too... :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
I'll admit it, my S/C doesn't have enough flow to beat a FI'd 3L. When I upgarde to the turbo, it will. :laugh:
BTW, Hector was only running an M45 supercharger. It was WAY too small. The M45 only flows 320CFM where the M62 pushes 510CFM. That translates to 352HP. Calculating drivetrain loss, that just over 300HP to the wheels. Considering roots blowers love NOS, just a 50shot would net me at least 60 more HP and 80TQ.
BTW#2, there are a couple Zetecers building engines using the CGI block. It can handle 30+ PSI of boost. Combine that with the FRPP head, FRPP intake, and a set of turbo cams. That a conservative 500HP.
...and us FI Zetecers are just plain :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
I'm going to be the happiest nutjob around when I'm stoping SVTs with my supercharged Zetec.
...stomping N/A 3L, and FI'd 2.5s too... :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
I'll admit it, my S/C doesn't have enough flow to beat a FI'd 3L. When I upgarde to the turbo, it will. :laugh:
BTW, Hector was only running an M45 supercharger. It was WAY too small. The M45 only flows 320CFM where the M62 pushes 510CFM. That translates to 352HP. Calculating drivetrain loss, that just over 300HP to the wheels. Considering roots blowers love NOS, just a 50shot would net me at least 60 more HP and 80TQ.
BTW#2, there are a couple Zetecers building engines using the CGI block. It can handle 30+ PSI of boost. Combine that with the FRPP head, FRPP intake, and a set of turbo cams. That a conservative 500HP.
...and us FI Zetecers are just plain :crazy: :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
The flaw in your main argument is that you're assuming your time is worthless. It's taking you a lot of time to get to just a modest level of performance. How many hours of work do you have to put in just to get to SVT-level performance?
And why are you whining about how it's cheaper? If that's your only goal, just buy an 80s Camaro or 1st gen AWD Turbo Eclipse. I guarantee you'll have a faster car with a better aftermarket. Actually, if you want to go fast, why would you get a Contour at all?
striker2
Official CEG Vendor
Time? asumming one had already bought the parts i could have the car up to SE or SVT performance in maybe 2 days.
Chepaer to buy a GSX? show me a good GSX for under $5k
Aftermarket? the aftermarket is overrated. make the parts you can yourself. if you want to base it on an aftermarket part fine.
Why a Contour? Why not? what is wrong with a contour that makes it not a good car to modify? the platform is a darn good one. why does everyone go for the imports? cause they "wanna be like mike" :laugh: and they dont have to actually know how it all works. they just buy the parts and pay someone to install them. i personally like to know how it works (went to auto tech school, i think i know) and do the work myself. which makes the contour a darn fine platform.
actually they go for the foxbody. why? cause its the lightest of all the mustangspurplemystique said:
PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
Wait...exactly what mods were going to get you an extra 70whp?
eBay motors is crawling with them. I just checked.
You're thinking very narrowly. When's the last time you made your own swaybars, intake and exhaust manifolds, heads, cams, etc. Competition is good, it drives prices down and forces innovation. When you have one company offering a certain product, they can charge whatever the heck they want.
Those were some wonderful generalizations about certain demographics. The Contour has potential for certain things, like handling, but definitely not straight line speed.
Uh...correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not) but wasn't the foxbody available in GT and Cobra trims? You missed my point completely.
striker2
Official CEG Vendor
intake, 2.5" exhaust, UDP, ported head, cams, 255lph fuel pump, adjustable FPR, maybe some bigger injectors, 4-2-1 header, cam gears, chip. theres an easy 60-70 horses right there if not more.
crawling with them? i count 5 1st gen gsx's. some of them may not even be decent. however even though their price is low right now they all have several days left on them and the price will go up a fair amount.PurpleMystique said:
i never said you can make everything yourself. simply the parts that you can make your self you should do. BTW an adjustable swaybar would be extremly easy to make. as for the exhaust manifold i will be with my new engine, we'll leave the guessing to you as to why im making an exhaust manifold.:laugh:Purplemystique said:
whoever said anything about making it fast just for the straights. you still need power to make a fast road course car.Purplemystique said:
Uh...correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not) but wasn't the foxbody available in GT and Cobra trims? You missed my point completely.[/quote]
no i got your point. my point on it is that they are gonna buy the cheapest one they can find (usually means a blown engine form a base model. since they are gonna drop in whatever engine they want anyways they dont care what engine it had to begin with. besides its even cooler when everyone thinks its just a base model fox body and they get blown away by a S/C V8. kinda my point with the zetec. they think its just a slow zetec contour, then you smoke them
PurpleMystique
Hard-core CEG'er
I guarantee you the majority of fast Mustangs are NOT base models.