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Amp install location.

steelblueSE said:
Aren't IB's mostly for SQ?
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I'll put it this way... IB setups are not the most efficient for spl, so they do tend to be used for sq more than spl. Usually the primary consideration with IB is space, then you pick the best driver for the specific application. Pick the wrong one, which is easy to do, and it will perform poorly no matter what you try to do with it.
 
Joe, What alpine amp is that? Only reason I ask is that I had a class-D Alpine amp powering my rear deck sub for a while and was never impressed with the sound quality, I swapped it to a 2-channel (bridged to 1) class AB PPI Art amp and it made a world of difference. Class D amps don't have as much control over the speaker's cone movement as say a Class AB due to the design and having a capacitor over the output channel so going to a Class AB amp for an IB setup is definitely the way to go.

To the OP, I'd recommend picking up an 8 gauge kit. 4 gauge is way overkill for that amp. The reason you would go to a 4 gauge kit is if you were running two amps and then you would have a distribution block near the amps to go from the single 4 gauge to two 8 gauge wires. Plus, it's not that you won't be able to flow enough power though an 8 gauge wire, the reason you go to a larger gauge is to avoid voltage drop.

Here's what i'd do...
http://www.knukonceptz.com/productDetail.cfm?prodID=KFX-AK8

and...
http://www.knukonceptz.com/productDetail.cfm?prodID=KARSS4.6M

Then you'd have a spare RCA cable but that's no big deal. That would be a quality set up that would be just about everything you need. Now, if you plan on running a sub or an additional amp, ignore what I said about the wiring... :)
 
I think having an art series amp itself was part of the sound quality improvement you heard, above and beyond the style of amplifier. The art series amplifiers were excellent sounding products. Which one did you have?
 
In my 99 Mystique I had an MTX RT2100x 2-channel amp running bridged to the rear-deck sub until I sold the car. I sold that setup to a friend and later decided I wanted to do a rear-deck sub in the SVT. So, I bought an Alpine MRP-M350 (mono, Class-D) amp thinking it would be an upgrade. Well it sounded ok but I was never overly thrilled and couldn't figure out why it did not sound as good as the old setup in the Mystique. Both used the same sub, both used the same mount and both rear-decks had similar sound deadening applied to them.

I knew that the only logical difference was the fact that I had changed the amplifier between the two cars. When I realized this I looked into the specs of both amps and then looked at the basic wiring schematics for a Class A/B amp and then that of a Class D amp. The basic diagram I found showed an inductor and a capacitor across the output channel which is not present in a Class A/B amplifier. Since ultimately, the goal of any amplifier is to control the speaker (not let the speaker do whatever it wants) I came to the realization that having the inductor and capacitor across the output channel could certainly affect the amplifier's ability to control the movement of the woofer cone.

Being an IB setup, the woofer cone's movement is even more critical than it is when it is in a sealed enclosure due to the fact that there is (virtually) no pressure buildup/decrease caused by the cone's movement. I believe this is why Class D amps work ok when powering subs in sealed enclosures but I don't think that that it's the best solution.

Anywho, I wanted something quality and I toyed with an older Alpine V12 amp but found a good deal on an A100 amp. Not a lot of power but then again you don't need a whole lot of power to drive an IB woofer.
 
That's a pretty interesting theory you have there 99Mystique. I never heard anything like this before. So are you saying that Class A/B amps performs better than Class D amps in sealed boxes? If so, please go into details. I'm asking for your knowledge on this so that I have a better understanding.

99Mystique ATX said:
I knew that the only logical difference was the fact that I had changed the amplifier between the two cars. When I realized this I looked into the specs of both amps and then looked at the basic wiring schematics for a Class A/B amp and then that of a Class D amp. The basic diagram I found showed an inductor and a capacitor across the output channel which is not present in a Class A/B amplifier. Since ultimately, the goal of any amplifier is to control the speaker (not let the speaker do whatever it wants) I came to the realization that having the inductor and capacitor across the output channel could certainly affect the amplifier's ability to control the movement of the woofer cone.

Being an IB setup, the woofer cone's movement is even more critical than it is when it is in a sealed enclosure due to the fact that there is (virtually) no pressure buildup/decrease caused by the cone's movement. I believe this is why Class D amps work ok when powering subs in sealed enclosures but I don't think that that it's the best solution.
Click to expand...
 
Lavell said:
That's a pretty interesting theory you have there 99Mystique. I never heard anything like this before. So are you saying that Class A/B amps performs better than Class D amps in sealed boxes? If so, please go into details. I'm asking for your knowledge on this so that I have a better understanding.
Click to expand...

The way I see it there are pros and cons to both setups. The class-D amplifier by design a bit more efficient and therefore is better suited to instances where higher power is needed. However, due to the design, a filter is needed across the output channel to clean up the output. You'd have to know the wiring schematic to know for sure as each amp varies slightly, but most will use a capacitor and an inductor to filter the output. I'm not sure what your electrical background is but capacitors are typically used to eliminate fluctuations in voltage. Essentially, they are used as a dampener.

Today, most of what you will see on the market are either Class AB or Class D amplifier (with the exception of the digital amplifiers). Class AB is denoted push-pull and is 70-75% efficient again depending on the amp design. Class AB does not require any type of filter and as long as it is a good quality amp will have good clean sound output. As well as good control of the speaker.

I would argue that a Class AB amp would be a noticeable improvement over a Class D amplifier in either an IB setup (no box) or a tuned (ported) setup. I would also say that you could probably notice a difference when using a woofer in a sealed enclosure although probably not as noticeable. In any setup, it is very important that the amplifier control the movement of the woofer cone.

SoundQ SVT is probably correct though, some of the improvement that I heard was going to a PPI Art amp which are known for being extremely good sounding and clean amplifiers. I can say however that even going from a low-end (by comparison to either the PPI or the Alpine) MTX Road Thunder amp to the Alpine Class D amp there was a noticeable difference in my rear deck sub which is a free-air IB setup.

This wikipedia link describes each amp class in depth a bit more...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amplifier_class#Power_amplifier_classes
 
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